acceptable paint stipple by professional?

[theogeorgio]

hi everyone. i have commissioned a professional painter and i am wondering if his work is of acceptable quality. i think theres too much paint stipple on a brand new plaster?

what do you think?

also shouldnt the skirting be better sanded?

i took a couple of pics to show but not sure how clear they are.. ill take some more tomorrow with better light

 

[misterhelpful]

For new plaster, that roller stipple is unacceptable, even if it had been done by a DIYer. The paint has been applied too thickly, with probably too thick a pile sleeve. Medium sleeves are fine to use on smooth surfaces, such as plaster, but it must be spread evenly and 'layed off' to achieve a good finish.
Is the stipple everywhere or just in a few random spots? Sometimes you can overlook the odd patch if there are a lot of odd little areas to be roll, and the paint will dry before you have chance to level off. A pro should sand it back and re-paint, if that happens.

As for the skirting, it appears that there has been a poor existing finish that hasn't been de-nibbed and was just painted over. If the painter did sand the skirting smooth, he has not cleaned up all the dust and has picked it up on his brush. To me, it looks like a combination of both. Either way, the finish is poor and, if I had left that kind of finish on a job, I would expect a complaint. Those gripper rods are horrible when sanding but an experienced decorator knows the tricks to avoid shredding their fingertips, so that's no excuse not to do it properly.

 

[opps]

How much did you pay for the labour? What was the effective day rate?

The plastering in the last photo looks pretty rough, is it representative of the rest of the plastering? Is it possible that the decorator spent so long preparing the walls that he cut corners elsewhere?

I don't understand why the first photo shows both stipple and brush marks.

If I had paid the market rate for a professional finish, I would not be happy. If I paid peanuts, I still wouldn't be happy, but I would accept it.

 

[theogeorgio]

How much did you pay for the labour? What was the effective day rate?

The plastering in the last photo looks pretty rough, is it representative of the rest of the plastering? Is it possible that the decorator spent so long preparing the walls that he cut corners elsewhere?

I don't understand why the first photo shows both stipple and brush marks.

If I had paid the market rate for a professional finish, I would not be happy. If I paid peanuts, I still wouldn't be happy, but I would accept it.

Thanks for the response. I paid day rate 110 live in stafford

The plaster was perfect so no imperfections on plaster. it shows brush marks as he brushed between the socket and skirting board as area was small. so he cut it with the brush

 

[theogeorgio]

For new plaster, that roller stipple is unacceptable, even if it had been done by a DIYer. The paint has been applied too thickly, with probably too thick a pile sleeve. Medium sleeves are fine to use on smooth surfaces, such as plaster, but it must be spread evenly and 'layed off' to achieve a good finish.
Is the stipple everywhere or just in a few random spots? Sometimes you can overlook the odd patch if there are a lot of odd little areas to be roll, and the paint will dry before you have chance to level off. A pro should sand it back and re-paint, if that happens.

As for the skirting, it appears that there has been a poor existing finish that hasn't been de-nibbed and was just painted over. If the painter did sand the skirting smooth, he has not cleaned up all the dust and has picked it up on his brush. To me, it looks like a combination of both. Either way, the finish is poor and, if I had left that kind of finish on a job, I would expect a complaint. Those gripper rods are horrible when sanding but an experienced decorator knows the tricks to avoid shredding their fingertips, so that's no excuse not to do it properly.

Thanks for your input. skirting was indeed due to a mixture of old and new, is it the painter responsibility to sand it? and by how much? to take it all the way back to remove lumps but keep wood dents?

i bought an electric sander to see how much i can clean it.is it a good idea?

 

[opps]

How much did you pay for the labour? What was the effective day rate?

The plastering in the last photo looks pretty rough, is it representative of the rest of the plastering? Is it possible that the decorator spent so long preparing the walls that he cut corners elsewhere?

I don't understand why the first photo shows both stipple and brush marks.

If I had paid the market rate for a professional finish, I would not be happy. If I paid peanuts, I still wouldn't be happy, but I would accept it.

Thanks for the response. I paid day rate 110 live in stafford

The plaster was perfect so no imperfections on plaster. it shows brush marks as he brushed between the socket and skirting board as area was small. so he cut it with the brush

Ok.

I assume that £110 is pretty much the going rate for your area. How long did the job take? How many doors' windows etc.

Sorry I am not trying to be awkward. I typically expect to take up to 5 days to paint a reasonable sized room. Approximately half of that time will be prep. A room with no carpet or furniture, plastic sockets/switches, single basic pendant light- you could easily apply 2 coats of emulsion (plus a mist coat) walls and ceilings (rolling only- no cutting in) in one day. However, I have never come across a newly plastered wall that didn't need any prep at all and looking at the last photo, those walls would have need some prep. New plaster often looks perfectly flat, it is only when you start to paint it that you notice the flaws. That said, the last photo shows an area that the decorator does not seem to have filled/sanded.

 

[theogeorgio]

How much did you pay for the labour? What was the effective day rate?

The plastering in the last photo looks pretty rough, is it representative of the rest of the plastering? Is it possible that the decorator spent so long preparing the walls that he cut corners elsewhere?

I don't understand why the first photo shows both stipple and brush marks.

If I had paid the market rate for a professional finish, I would not be happy. If I paid peanuts, I still wouldn't be happy, but I would accept it.

Thanks for the response. I paid day rate 110 live in stafford

The plaster was perfect so no imperfections on plaster. it shows brush marks as he brushed between the socket and skirting board as area was small. so he cut it with the brush

Ok.

I assume that £110 is pretty much the going rate for your area. How long did the job take? How many doors' windows etc.

Sorry I am not trying to be awkward. I typically expect to take up to 5 days to paint a reasonable sized room. Approximately half of that time will be prep. A room with no carpet or furniture, plastic sockets/switches, single basic pendant light- you could easily apply 2 coats of emulsion (plus a mist coat) walls and ceilings (rolling only- no cutting in) in one day. However, I have never come across a newly plastered wall that didn't need any prep at all and looking at the last photo, those walls would have need some prep. New plaster often looks perfectly flat, it is only when you start to paint it that you notice the flaws. That said, the last photo shows an area that the decorator does not seem to have filled/sanded.

he did not paint the doors just walls and skirtings i think 1.5 day. it appears he did no prep work, i noticed a gap between the skirting and plasterboard that i can easily stick my pinky in.. didnt cork it.. i would expect he should fill it?

if im paying him by the day shouldnt he just at least what he should do to do a good job?

if you saw my skirting comment in quote above/.. i suppose he could have told me thats not fixable? because i had some expectations in my head

sorry but im just wondering if i am over the top or the work indeed doesnt worth the money

 

[opps]

Thanks for your input. skirting was indeed due to a mixture of old and new, is it the painter responsibility to sand it? and by how much? to take it all the way back to remove lumps but keep wood dents?

I bought an electric sander to see how much I can clean it.is it a good idea?

The degree of prep to be undertaken is a tough call. Removing lumps requires sanding, dents must be filled and then sanded and if you want a decent finish you will need to use 2 pack filler which takes longer to sand, and from time to time, whilst sanding it, the surrounding paint overheats and blisters.

I know my clients, and vary the level of prep (and price) accordingly. When dealing with a new client it is less straight forward. I am concious that I am potentially competing with other decorators. I don't want to price myself out of a job BUT there are minimum levels I am willing to work to. I would have only left your job in that state if you had expressly told me not to do any prep.

Regarding your electric sander. The paint is probably still pretty soft. Hand sanding might be better.

Gripper rods are evil. Either rip them up and get new ones fitted later or put thin strips of carpet over them whilst you sand the upper parts of the skirting.

 

[opps]

he did not paint the doors just walls and skirtings i think 1.5 day. it appears he did no prep work, i noticed a gap between the skirting and plasterboard that i can easily stick my pinky in.. didnt cork it.. i would expect he should fill it?

if im paying him by the day shouldnt he just at least what he should do to do a good job?

if you saw my skirting comment in quote above/.. i suppose he could have told me thats not fixable? because i had some expectations in my head

sorry but im just wondering if i am over the top or the work indeed doesnt worth the money

So the guy pretty much allowed half a day for the woodwork and cutting in.

At the risk of sounding blunt, the quality of finish is commensurate with the price. If I had quoted (no carpets no door, no windows), my (london based) price would have been 4 days at £150 (labour and sundries only), you might not have been happy with the price but you would have been with the quality of finish.
Have you spoken to the guy? The finish is pants and I am tempted to say that you have got what you paid for- they bloke didn't rip you off, however if you do want a decent finish you are going to have to pay another decorator to re-do the work (ie, pay twice).
Sorry, I appreciate that I am not helping. I guess that you need to chalk it up to experience and take it on the chin. There are a lot of people that have (relatively) recently entered the "construction industry". Decorating is often seen as being the end of the food chain, many of those newer entrants think that buying a couple of brushes and a roller qualifies them as being experienced. I am by no means expensive but I have in excess of £10,000 of tools (approximately £3000 of which are sanders and dust extractors). The irony is that when I look at the rents (living costs) in Salford and my capital expenditure, I am probably making less money than your decorator. I am not complaining, I am simply suggesting that people need to look beyond the bottom line when determining what is, or isn't good value.
Best of luck

 

[opps]

sorry but im just wondering if i am over the top or the work indeed doesnt worth the money

You aren't being over the top. There had been a communication break-down. Both parties are at fault. In spite of my general tone, based upon what you have told us, I do sympathise (assuming that you hadn't received quotes from other decorators than were rejected because they were more expensive).

As a general rule of thumb, when dealing with tradesmen, try to go on recommendation rather than, for example, price, but only do day rate if the job has lots of variables and ask about worst/best case scenarios. Explain exactly what you want, with regard to the quality of finish. If a price is too cheap, something has to give. Convention wisdom recommends getting 3 quotes if not going on recommendation. I concur but do not take 3 quotes from the kind of people that only provide mobile numbers.

 

[Bosswhite]

The last two photos look like an Artex Finish ??
I agree the majority of the work is poor, ( why was this not pointed out at the beginning/during instead of the finish of the job ??)

A certain amount of the problem does come down to modern day decorators tools and the paints, Rollers instead of Brushes, to get Water based paints (Satin Sheens etc) to a consistency to apply smoothly, now most solvent paints have gone is an art initself.
Paints these days have to be Eco Friendly, not smell, quick dry, cover in one coat without any rubbing down.

 

[theogeorgio]

i will give you a bit more details....

i had someone else who did skiming and painting i kept asking him to do good work and fix things and kept telling me he will do it, in teh end he did a very bad job and had brought other people to see the work and were appalled.

i now got a new guy to skim did a great job! i asked the guy if he knows a decorator.. he gave me the details of a guy... turns out its his dad! his dad wanted 110 another guy 120 and had another for 100 a day.

he came in and had a look at the previous guy job and told me how he could do better! and pointed out otherguys stipple etc

so i commissioned this guy and i came home on friday to find out from my wife he finished at 1 because tehre wasnt much else to do.. still had to skim some other parts of the house.. but there were other ceilings to paint sand etc..

he is coming on monday to continue.. and im wondering if i should let him continue... a

if it wasnt for the skirting... is the wall acceptable? someone said it looks like artex?!

 

[Bosswhite]

This Photo looks like Artex Stipple Finish to me !!!

 

[opps]

ok, so you have been proactive.

perhaps you can point out the faults and see what he says. Specify the quality of finish that you want. Get him to sort out the skirting at an agreed price. If he does it well, then give him more work. If it looks rough, tell him that your cat needs expensive emergency care and that you will have to postpone the other jobs for now (or something like that).

 

[opps]

This Photo looks like Artex Stipple Finish to me !!!

Agreed.

It looks like the coats have been applied very thickly, possibly before the previous coat had dried sufficiently.

I often use a longer nap roller than is recommended but I don't overload it and roll through. If I am concerned about stipple/build up, I run the DA over it with 180 grit (or add floetrol to the emulsion)