Build- over rejection :( Advice appreciated!

[rupes30]

Hi all,

Having a bit of a nightmare with Severn Trent.

We applied for planning permission to build a new detached dwelling. ST were consulted during the planning phase and didn't object (they didn't respond at all). Planning permission was subsequently approved.

Side note, when we bought our property the drainage search showed no drainage on our property. Does anyone know who's duty it is to update the map?

We have a foul and storm 100mm gravity sewer running down the back of our house. It serves one property other than ours.

We submitted a build over application because there are also two manholes within the footprint of the new build. The application was submitted in June 2018, we chased in December as we'd received no response. A response was finally received in January 2019 (when we'd started work clearing the site) and it was a rejection because it is ST's policy not to allow build-overs to new dwellings. I can't find any mention of this policy anywhere on ST's website. it actually states under new build: "We'll work with you to provide our consent so that your project may proceed; ensuring that both your property and our pipes are protected."

ST will not allow a diversion or build over, we are having to submit a planning amendment to move the building forward off the drain. They have also stated we could then build an extension over the pipe and they would be ok with that as it's an extension! So we'd end up with the exact same building.

Our architect submitted an identical application for another client recently and that went through with no issue.

I feel like we've just got unlucky with the engineer that's picked up our case. Has anyone appealed or escalated a case successfully with ST? I'm just not sure which route to take at this point.

Thanks

 

[^woody^]

Use ST's complaints system and then go via the Consumer Council for Water.

 

[garyo]

I didn't think they could ever disallow development as such, just a case of how far your trousers will have to come down to engineer a solution that will satisfy them?

Is your house over that new mega sewer in London?

 

[rupes30]

Use ST's complaints system and then go via the Consumer Council for Water.

Thanks I'll try this. I've been chatting to a solicitor who thinks we have a strong case but I don't want to use that card just yet, don't want to annoy them and make things worse..

I didn't think they could ever disallow development as such, just a case of how far your trousers will have to come down to engineer a solution that will satisfy them?

Is your house over that new mega sewer in London?

They can go to the ankles if it gets it sorted!

Nope, I'm in the midlands.

 

[ivixor]

No new dwellings is pretty standard rules. Anglian have the same.

You will need to divert it. Might not cost as much as you think.

 

[rupes30]

No new dwellings is pretty standard rules. Anglian have the same.

You will need to divert it. Might not cost as much as you think.

I'm happy to divert it, but they're not giving us the option.

 

[akist]

In my case the sewers are private (so we pay for their upkeep) and only after going through a dozen plots do they merge and connect to the public sewer at street level. I was not aware that you can have public sewers running under your land? What happens if repairs are needed, they can enter your property?

 

[Notch7]

In my case the sewers are private (so we pay for their upkeep) and only after going through a dozen plots do they merge and connect to the public sewer at street level. I was not aware that you can have public sewers running under your land? What happens if repairs are needed, they can enter your property?

Sewers were adopted by water authorities in 2011.

A sewer pipe from your house is private, but when it crosses into a neighbour it becomes a public drain.

Yes they can enter your property and probably dig a great big hole in your floor.

If an extension is built over a drain with no agreement, in theory the water authority can force you to have it taken down.

It bugs me its called a build over agreement, but it should really be a build over or build near agreement, as the rules come into force if you build within 3 metres.

 

[Dereekoo]

In my case the sewers are private (so we pay for their upkeep) and only after going through a dozen plots do they merge and connect to the public sewer at street level. I was not aware that you can have public sewers running under your land? What happens if repairs are needed, they can enter your property?

You can have public sewers ,sewage pumping mains ,water supply pipes going through your land if the water companies decide that is where it needs to go. Obviously certain procedures have to be followed but their powers are quite Draconian, all stemming from the 1936 Public Health Act

 

[akist]

A sewer pipe from your house is private, but when it crosses into a neighbour it becomes a public drain.

This sewer, is it taking flow from just your neighbours property

We live on a hill and the sewers cross many plots chain-linking one house to the next. My neighbour on the north is higher than me and the sewer pipe comes from him, crosses all over my plot, and then cuts in to the neighbour to the east where it continues crossing more plots until it reaches the street level main sewers.

When the sewer pipes were blocked by tree roots, admittedly maybe 2005-ish, at the last plot before the street, and the poor man had overflow of a dozen houses's sewage in his house, all houses involved paid for the re-boring of the sewer pipe under his land, done by a private firm. Of course it was his trees causing the issue but somehow we all paid.

Are we now saying that all these sewers belong to the water company?

 

[Notch7]

Are we now saying that all these sewers belong to the water company?

Yes.

Had they got blocked post 2011 the water authority wouldve sorted it out FOC.

It was introduced to stop these issues. But it means nobody knows where all these adopted drains go -many under extensions.

 

[StephenOak]

Are we now saying that all these sewers belong to the water company?

Yes.

Sewers were adopted by water authorities in 2011.

Some explanation:
https://www.ofwat.gov.uk/publications/transfer-of-private-sewers/

This
https://www.severntrentsearches.com/the-con29dw-explained-sewer-adoption-agreements/
is mainly about new sewers but does mention the 20111 transfer. In there it says

"Not only does [the transfer] mean the owner is no longer responsible for their upkeep, it also means they’re in the hands of a company that has the legal powers, financial resources and expertise to maintain them."

Also I believe that part of the reasoning was to avoid situations like you described becoming acrimonious when someone (or some group) refused to pay or refused access to their land.

 

[Ceej]

Would like to know if OP resolved this situation?