Buying a house with subsidence caused by next-door new build and negligence. Worth it?

[Adrian1662]

Hi all, it’s an interesting one I hope. House in London in a very good neighbourhood and street avg c£1m came to the market. I'm not a builder, just a family looking to upscale because of kids. Problem in my neighbourhood are the houses that shoot up in values over the last few years.

This Victorian beauty requires a total refurb inside out, which I like but it looks like it has a structural problem of subsidence caused by the new (2006) house built next door (which probably had a deeper foundation).

What do you think, looks like subsidence based on cracks inside and outside?

I'm yet to bring a structural eng in but need to consider if it's worth the effort before going into mega debt on unworthy project.

 

[motorbiking]

You need to know if the claim has been settled and if not if a party wall agreement was served and the condition of the walls prior to the party wall agreement being put in place. If there was no agreement then you can take action against the home owner for the damage / repair. But its likely that you are not a party to the claim.

You will need some legal advice as it may well be that the current owner is the party that can make the claim as he is the one who has suffered losses (i.e. reduction in value), not you. So you will need to ensure all rights to claim are transferred to you as part of the purchase.

Alternatively you purchase "as is" and value accordingly

 

[Adrian1662]

Thanks, the owner is not acting on his own his family is. He may have neglected that over the years due to his state. But can any claims be made if construction was done in 2006? The house owner of the newish neighbour house has little to do with the situation as he bought of the developer so who would that claim be raised against?

 

[Notch7]

Your difficulty might be establishing whether the subsidence is solely due to neighbour or due to poor ground.

If its poor ground, can it be made stable?


I did some work on a 8 bedroom property in Sussex for a developer I know -the spine wall had dropped by almost 6". He bought the house at a fraction of its usual value, got a company in to stablise it with foam injection, made the house mortgageable and made a tidy sum selling (about £500k profit I think)

So if you are prepared to take the risk, you might strike lucky.

bear in mind you might not be able to get a mortgage on it until its been made stable

here is a link to underpinning:

Geobear Underpinning - Geobear

Subsidence or sinking floors repaired in 1-2 days with resin injection as the modern alternative to underpinning.

subsidence.geobear.co.uk

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

You need to know if the claim has been settled

What claim? The OP has no idea if it's probable subsidence or not and if so what the cause is or how it can be remedied. If its not subsidence the survey should also provide a solution for that. He needs to establish all this now for himself or walk away. The owners don't sound forthcoming and in anycase any survey they might have/pay for will be written in their favour.

 

[George_engineer]

I'd be tempted. If it was done in 2006 things could well have stabilised to a new equalibrium. Crack monitoring for 6 - 12 months would be needed to verify this. If it has stabilised on its own then crack stitching the brickwork would be enough.

If there is ongoing movement then local underpinning is still an option - as Notch says, cementitious or polymer grouting worth looking at.

The main issue will be getting it approved and signed off as resolved for insurance and reselling. So getting a definitive what approval will be required before you start.

 

[Adrian1662]

Thanks, think you are spot on. Establish if neighbour wall was done properly with enforcing old’s house foundations but poor ground or some leaking pipe made ground unstable for middle house foundations. Or neighbour house wall is the problem. You’d have to dig up to see. Is this part of structural survey?

There’s lot of interest in this property but sale price leaves tiny margin to be made considering the risks. On the market for £600k, pre market offer (you can see someone vetted it already) for £500k apparently rejected. Fully done house with extension downstairs would go for £850k.

And the pivotal question re mortgage, would main lender like NatWest give the money with subsistence? House got electrics and heating working.

Will go there tonight with an engineer but not sure what else he can say by visual inspection.

 

[Nige F]

Take a psychic - then walk away anyway. London -schmondon-

 

[motorbiking]

What claim? The OP has no idea if it's probable subsidence or not and if so what the cause is or how it can be remedied. If its not subsidence the survey should also provide a solution for that. He needs to establish all this now for himself or walk away. The owners don't sound forthcoming and in anycase any survey they might have/pay for will be written in their favour.

It entirely depends if there was a party wall agreement. No agreement flips the burden to the neighbours. But (and there are loads)…

They may well be able to prove it was.. say a failed drain pipe / sewer etc. there might even be a shared sewer under the neighbours land that has been damaged.

The claim may be out of time etc..

The failure to act may be contributory negligence

Etc etc.

If it was me I’d be valuing “as is” and getting an estimate to fix as that is the worse case scenario.

 

[HERTS P&D]

RUN! Don't look back, find another property!

Andy

 

[Nige F]

Yes, don't look back in anger ( or Ongar if it's there)

 

[kingandy2nd]

Should be fine, there’s some structural silicone in that big crack

Not a chance you’re getting a mortgage on that place as is.

 

[Loofah]

Walk away. It's not worth another thought

 

[cdbe]

There's no claim for you 16 years later.

I think that many builders and developers would not be put off and will take a punt on any settlement having ceased - the cause and effect seems fairly obvious. That house will likely have a "foundation" of two end on bricks about 2 feet below the ground, the new builders will have undermined that and it probably rained and washed out part of whatever was under your "foundation", they will have poorly backfilled it - hence the settlement.

As for a mortgage, I would have thought that that minor cracking was fairly normal for crap London housing stock.

What would put me off is the forecasts of 10-15% falls in house prices and what that would do to my sums.