Cabinet doors with vertical grooves

[sky_bum]

Howdy,

Short version: I want to build a 500mm wide door out of cladding only. Can I?

Longer version:
I'm building some new frameless kitchen cabinets and the missus likes the frameless vertical groove pattern look she saw at ikea. I assumed we would only put in drawers so I went and bought some 94mmx14mm cladding from wickes which I was going to glue together and stick to the drawer kit face.

I have never used cladding before and I am sort of worried about the wobbliness but since I was going to fix it to the drawer face I assume I can happily ignore that.

However, on one of the cabinets we (i.e. the missus) have decided to put in a hinged door (500mm wide) and I am not sure if the cladding would be stable enough on its own. Does any one have any advice/ experience with using the cladding on its own for a door like this?

 

[OwainDIYer]

Cladding needs to be fixed to a supporting frame. It has no strength or rigidity on its own.

Battens top and bottom will hold the cladding, but you'll have to work out where to put the hinges.

 

[big-all]

think off a "Z" frame

the problem you will have is the drawer will be say 15mm thick plus the cladding at say 9mm so about 24mm thick
normal kitchens hinges cannot cope with 24mm
you cannot use "normal " hinges on surface mounted doors as you need door thickness plus a bit between each door for swing
if they are internal then the "nuckle" or hinge point needs to be level or slightly proud off the front face

 

[foxhole]

The ikea doors are sheet 18mm mdf with grooves routed in them, you cannot reproduce that with thin cladding.

 

[sky_bum]

Apologies for the delay in response and thanks to everyone for the replies - had trouble with the laptop charger and took a while till a new one was sorted out.

I am aware about MDF, but for various reasons I would prefer my furniture to be "au-naturel".

It looks like I will need a supporting frame and even the thick cladding won't do. Will try it out with some thin metal strips and see how it goes.

 

[big-all]

dependant on cladding thickness chosen you could use say 6mm ply
6x9=15
as long as its less than 18mm yolu should be fine

 

[sky_bum]

A bit of an update. I used a router to give a curved edge to some reused planks I had lying around (slightly twisted) and glued them using biscuits/ wood glue into a board. The twist from the original planks carried over somewhat, but I had the resulting board pressed over a couple of days and the end result was a quite decent reproduction of the ikea design using solid wood and fairly straight board.

However, after a couple of days the board developed the twist again. The planks were primed on the curved side, but the other side wasn't protected.

I plan to try again with some proper PSE planks, but should I expect a twist to develop regardless of how square the original planks are?

EDIT: if I use the board for drawer fronts would the joint with the bottom drawer and the drawer sides be enough to prevent warps or would I also need a supporting structure near the top of the front?

 

[Deleted member 174758]

....after a couple of days the board developed the twist again. The planks were primed on the curved side, but the other side wasn't protected.

Which is why they warped - any thin timber surface must be sealed on both sides (called "balancing") and ideally adequately supported to avoid this sort of thing happening

I plan to try again with some proper PSE planks, but should I expect a twist to develop regardless of how square the original planks are?

You may be on a hiding to nothing, here. Kitchens tend to be environments where the air humidity levels go up and down like a yo-yo, which is whay a lot of modern kitchens are made from extremely stable man-made boards. Where they are made from solid wood the preference is to make them using a frame and panel design - a technique dating back at least 600 years which was introduced because it aids stability. Take a look around and you'll tend to only see planked timber where there are cross braces on the rear, e.g. braced or braced and ledged plank doors (as found on ye olde worldy cottages, etc). This is why the respondents above have mentioned the need for framing or cross battening. Fixing solid wood onto a substrate of MFC (melamine faced chipboard - the material used for carcassing and often for kitchen drawer boxes) is another thing to be wary of because timber moves with changes in humidity, etc whereas MFC doesn't

 

[big-all]

depends on the drawer construction and size
also the amount off the twist
you need a full enclosed structure to use up twisted boards
by that i mean a cabinet or structure underneath to screw to if you attach a twisted plank to a board unless the theres a equal force to hold it it will twist the other board in proportion

you can minimise the effect by using for smaller length componants
and you can cut into strips off say 2-4" wide glue back together and sand the raised bits off but that will only work on loose glued timber

 

[gregers]

did you alternate the grain on the boards you glued?
this helps a bit to stop cupping.

 

[sky_bum]

Thanks to all three of you for the replies. I don't plan to use twisted boards - they were just some boards I had lying around from a dismantled project and I figured I'd test on them first.

I will try to relevel the board and fix it with a Z-brace at the back (I am not much bothered by it, but I thought it would look nice without) and prime on both sides (not sure why I left one unprimed but it seemed a good idea at the time) and see how long that holds up.

Just as a thought, would you recommend to use solid wood or cast iron for the brace? The handles I got are cast iron and they would match the brace if someone opens it up.