Joomla what does using it mean?

[ericmark]

I have used Front Page and Dreamweaver to assist me writing web pages. Normally use it in code option but they both have colour changes which alerts me if I make a mistake.

A friend wants to use a page similar to mine. http://gw7mgw.freeiz.com/Coed-Nant-Gain/CNG25.html however the guys who right the page use this Joomla and tell him all sorts of things like can't wrap text around pictures and can't have two changing pictures on a page etc. They also said they don't use pictures of text, or use CSS or Java Script but when I looked at the pages they were clearly telling fibs as this http://www.freetheforest.org/ page uses them all.

So does using the Joomla thing limit what they can do in some way? I did try to use it but just seems over complex and could just not get my head around it.

 

[Phil54]

Joomla is very different to the likes of Frontpage or Dreamweaver in what it is trying to do.

Just to be clear, I don't use it. so some of this is going to be a bit generic. But I do use a more commercial heavyweight tool to do much of what it does.

Joomla isn't so much a tool to design websites, like FP or Dreamweaver, but more of a tool to help users maintain them.

Let me explain that. As a developer, you might design and install a Joomla site, design templates, etc. But the actual maintenance of the CONTENT of the site, as opposed to layout, design, etc, can be done by users.

The tool I use (and Joomla is, I believe, similar) lets me design the structure of the site, templates that create pages, database structure, and so on. And to create users with various levels of permissions. Those users, depending on the permissions the site admin sets, may be able to upload and "publish" articles, or may be able to upload them, but the articles then wait in a queue until an editor "approves" them.

The site content, maintained by "user" levels of people, gets added to a database, and when a visitor browses the site, content is extracted from the database, formatted according to the templates, and presented to the end user.

In other words, it's a "content management system". You, as a developer, might be expected to install Joomla (or whatever CMS gets used), and to design or amend templates, etc, but non-technical people can add content to the site.

So, it might be a site on gardening, cars or, let's face it, DIY, and the people adding content might know all about gardening, cars or DIY, but naff-all about computers or web design. Yet, they can add, amend or delete (subject to permissions) content.

Your skills as a developer might be needed to amend the site, but not to add, amend or delete the content. Exactly how far that "management" function goes varies according to the exact, CMS, and as I said, I don't use Joomla.

Hope that helps.

 

[ericmark]

I think I understand a little of what is going on. From what I can gather just like I do with Java Script I see something I like and I look how it's done and often used a pre-built chunk of script rather than design from scratch.

It would seem his web designers have done something similar in finding chunks of code both CSS and Java Script that does what they want and inserted it wholesale into the site.

I look at the CSS and much is not used by the page so I guess they are just crossing fingers and hope it works.

However what you have described as should happen is exactly what we want. I am a real beginner HTML is OK but CSS and Java are scratchy and as to SQL well did a little Access at college but my late sister did more the work for me.

What I had considered is Iframes so I can produce a page which is then embedded into the main site so the viewer has no idea the content is not on the main site.

From what you are saying with Joomla there should be no need for this it's designed to allow access for updates?

While they were building the site although I was there it seemed very cloak and dagger and they were not really willing to let me see what they were up to.

The Client said he wanted a duel picture with user controls so they could either adjust speed of change or manually change pairs of pictures. At which they replied it can't be done. The response was well Eric (that's me) has already done it. Which did not really put me in a good position. I had thought I was working with experts not a bunch of amateurs and my worry was that my page design may not work on all browsers.

This is my biggest worry miss out //--> with firefox and it does not matter but with IE8 it falls over. It took me an age to find out why it reported a fault. Still having problems with CSS can't see my mistake but works A1 with firefox but not with IE8. No wonder I am losing hair.

 

[WoodYouLike]

Why not try it for free for 30 days on CloudAccess hosting? That's how I started with Joomla - having worked with Dreamweaver before.

There are a loads of "apps/extensions" also available you can upload/insert into a Joomla site, such as "field" that changes the pictures at random etc.

Here's our site, created in/on/with Joomla: www.woodyoulike.co.uk with in the left top corner such a field (static per page, but changing the image on every next page or refresh)

 

[Phil54]

....

From what you are saying with Joomla there should be no need for this it's designed to allow access for updates?.....

Well, as I said, I don't use Joomla, and not all CMS's work the same way, so I'm having to be fairly non-specific.

In general, the idea of a CMS is that the user needs no technical skills.

For example (and I'll put it in quotes to separate it) a site WRITER might type something like

The latest news from Downing Street.

text words blah blah blah text words blah blah blah. Blah text words blah blah blah

** picture 1 **

blah blah text words blah blah blah.

That gets stored in a database, along with some metadata (like author's name, date, category, title, sub-head, picture captions, etc.

So all the writer needs to be able to do is write the article and fill in a form .... and hit 'submit'.

The system then stores it in a (usually) MySQL database.

When a site visitor comes along and goes to the "politics" category, or does a search on "Downing Street", that article gets pulled out of the database, formatted according to pre-defined templates, the [pictures inserted where that ** picture ** tag says to insert it, and it's presented to the visitor's browser.

There are, if you like, two levels of development that can be added to that. One is to write the code that determines things like database handling, and the other is to design the styles, templates etc that present the content to the user. You MIGHT not have any say over the code part. Some CMS's are proprietary in their code, and all you can really do is to design the templates, etc. Oh, and the database programming will be pre-written but, like Access, you can add or delete fields, specify field types, etc, to suit the nature of the site you're designing.

Other CMS's provide the code in an open format and you can (within the terms of the licence) adapt, amend and develop the code .... but you might sacrifice support, and cause problems with implementing software updates if you do.

Quite where Joomla falls in those two camps I don't know, though I'd guess it's in the "open" not proprietary camp.

But exactly what you can do with the site will depend quite a lot of whether you cvan do it in HTML, of CSS, or Javascript, etc, and whether the system permits that, or whether you need to get into the programming of the CMS itself.

On that, I can't help you. WoodYouLike may be able to, if he has built a Joomla site.

It's worth bearing in mind, though, that products like Joomla are specifically designed to bring the development of quite varied and versatile sites to those that, while they are technically minded, aren't full-time and experienced developers. How far you can take a Joomla site will very much depend on :-

- your ability
- any inherent limitations of Joomla.[/quote]

 

[ericmark]

After finding today the slider I have been using although working fine with FireFox failed and created loads of pop up warning when used with IE I can see the point in using pre-tested formats and just dropping in what you want to use.

WoodYouLike's site does look good and the alternative picture on each refresh does work well.

I expect this is why so many sites look so similar with the same drop down menu etc.

So now it seems I need to remove the sliders in loads of web pages or find the fault. This is where I miss not being able to call on my late sister for help.