Planning Permission (Granted), simultaneous Permitted Development

[Nigel K]

I have a semi detached property in BUCKS. On appeal, PP was granted for a front dormer window. The architect said I should only apply for PP for the dormer as a rear loft conversion I also wanted to do would fall under PD.

Now that I am looking for quotes, someone raised concerns about doing the PP and PD work simultaneously, saying they would have to be done as 2 separate builds. Is this really the case? Purely from a cost (scaffolding etc) and convenience point it would be better to do all the work together.

if the answer is yes, short of going through the entire planning process again, is there any other 'speedy' application or notice that I might be able to make use of? I was hoping to have the work completed before winter.

Thanks.

 

[wessex101]

As long as the front dormer works are physically separate from the rear dormer then you should be able to do them simultaneously. It only becomes an issue if the permitted development works are actually attached to the approved works. In the same way the front dormer would not affect a PD rear extension or front porch. I think the person who suggested it has got confused that the loft conversion requires planning permission whereas it is just the front dormer itself.

 

[^woody^]

If the "someone" is the bloke down the pub then you can ignore them. If the someone is a paid up member of the RTPI then you could listen to them.

 

[lt8480]

By rear loft conversion I assume you mean rear loft extension with dormers.

If the PD works and planning permission works do not physically join then you can do them in one go. Assuming your rear dormers don't touch the front dormer then I'd agree with your architect and disagree with someone.

Generally the only time you need to use two build phases is used when a large extension would be against policy, so instead you build much as possible under PD, then apply for planning for just the extra bit you cannot do under PD.

The other way around (planning then PD) doesn't offer anything from what I can tell... as if you build a extension with planning permission you can't then use PD rights for anything that then touches that extension (Unless the whole extension combined would fall under PD, although this is unlikely to ever be the case as you wouldn't have bothered with planning the first time around. The only exception would be if the PD rules have relaxed since the planning application).

 

[Nigel K]

Thanks wessex101 and also to it8480, very helpful. As the work entails removing all the existing joists and tiles and replacing with new perhaps it is considered connected, even if the front dormer does not touch the apex of the rear roof, or might have to do with the way the drawings were presented for planning permission, I am not sure.

To woody... it is always difficult to work out why people waste their time making such useless unhelpful comments in forums which were without doubt set up to assist. FYI, the 'someone' is a member of the Fed of Master Builders who quoted on the work. Thank goodness they raised the issue. The architect, who returned this morning from abroad, and I chatted this morning and he agreed. It is not as bad as it sounds and will not require scaffolding coming down and then being re-erected some time later... and as I type, I have just received word that the the council would have been unhappy with one build but are now happy with this.

Once again, thanks wessex101 and it8480.

 

[lt8480]

From my understanding on the PD rules it is only the "touching" of added volumes that matters and nothing to do with extent of construction work.

If my interpretation is wrong and "touching" includes replacing existing items or internal alterations then two build stages still wouldn't help achieve anything. Because, if you do the planning works first, then the PD afterwards wouldn't be possible as all the works would all have to fall under PD. If you did it the other way around, with the PD first, then your planning permission wouldn't be valid as what you build at no point would have ever matched your drawings.

Therefore if the rule is a volumetric "touch" you can built all in one go. If this is not the correct interpretation then you would either need to get planning for everything in one go to build both simultaneously, or you need to build phase 1 under PD, then re-apply for planning for phase 2 once phase 1 PD works are complete.

 

[wessex101]

I agree. Replacing the roof "joists" and tiles (assuming it is a like for like replacement) would not need planning permission so it has no impact on the status of the dormers.