Re-Routing Electrical Cables In The Cellar

[John Peden]

I've just moved into a Victorian property with a cellar that I'd like to convert into a proper utility area for now and liveable space in the long-term. There are effectively three rooms in the cellar: one below the hallway, one below the living room (front) and one below the dining room (rear). The dining room is relatively uncomplicated, there is a flourescent tube over a workbench on one side and a single wire running to the boiler at the rear corner of the property. Similarly, there isn't much going on beneath the hallway.

The same cannot be said for the space beneath the living room. A bundle of around 7 three-core cables runs diagonally across the room, a separate bundle runs along one wall, there is a ceiling rose in the middle of the room and a series of junction boxes by the bottom of the stairs. This appears to be a very poor job as the several of the junction boxes are simply taped shut.

There are electircal outlets dotted around all three rooms on this level and all of the wires are fixed to the lath and plaster ceiling which really needs to be pulled down and replaced at some point.

Where would you start with something like this? I had a spark in at the weekend fitting some new plug sockets and when I showed him the cellar he seemed a bit overwhelmed by it all. Would it be worthwhile breaking it down into smaller tasks e.g. removing the lights, removing the plugs and then re-routing the cables in a way that - once the ceiling had been pulled down - would allow them to be tucked into the space between the joists?

 

[securespark]

Can you post some photos, please?

We like pictures!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I had a spark in at the weekend fitting some new plug sockets and when I showed him the cellar he seemed a bit overwhelmed by it all. Would it be worthwhile breaking it down into smaller tasks e.g. removing the lights, removing the plugs and then re-routing the cables in a way that - once the ceiling had been pulled down - would allow them to be tucked into the space between the joists?

It would be worthwhile showing it to a proper electrician.

 

[John Peden]

Pictures? You're in luck: https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0T5qXGF1wWDjE

 

[Taylortwocities]

Do you need building control involved in that?
You’ll probably need interlinked smoke alarms through the house, and a fire exit from the cellar.

 

[John Peden]

Do you need building control involved in that?
You’ll probably need interlinked smoke alarms through the house, and a fire exit from the cellar.

I have no idea mate. I've never owned a house before!

I think there is one smoke alarm in the loft...might be worth looking into in more detail though. Regarding the fire escape, a big window that a large human could climb through should be sufficient, shouldn't it?

 

[JohnW2]

Do you need building control involved in that?

If you're talking about the OP's long-term plan to eventually create habitable rooms in the cellar, he presumably would (and maybe even planning permission) - but his present exercise (constituting the cellar as a 'proper utility area') is probably no different from what most people do with cellars, so I imagine would not require any BC involvement. ... but, as always, I might be wrong!

You’ll probably need interlinked smoke alarms through the house, and a fire exit from the cellar.

From what has been described, I'm not convinced that such a requirement does not already exist, without any changes. Interestingly, in my house, the cellar (which has an outside door) actually constitutes a secondary escape route from some parts of the house.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Taylortwocities]

I was referring to his eventual plan. There’s things to consider if the property becomes more than two floors.

Nothing to worry about for stage 1.
I would suggest he gets a damp company to advise and maybe look at tanking that cellar, before other works are done.

 

[John Peden]

I was referring to his eventual plan. There’s things to consider if the property becomes more than two floors.

Nothing to worry about for stage 1.
I would suggest he gets a damp company to advise and maybe look at tanking that cellar, before other works are done.

The property has a room-in-roof, so the liveable area is already spread over 3 floors. However, all the houses on the street were built this way so while there is a smoke alarm on the top floor (possibly others than I've not noticed on the ground and first) I believe this has been installed by choice rather than compulsion.

Regarding the damp, I would like to tank it to ensure it remains comfortably dry, but the timeframe for turning it into liveable space might be 5 years or more. There was no abnormal damp detected by the structural survey or in a followup damp and timber survey. That said, the survey did highlight that the cellar (as I'm sure is the case for every other property of this age that hasn't undergone additional work) was probably too damp and too poorly ventilated for habitable space.

 

[JohnW2]

I was referring to his eventual plan. There’s things to consider if the property becomes more than two floors.

I realised that, but my suspicion was that (assuming the house had two floors above ground) that might possible already be the case if the (clearly quite extensive) cellar 'counted'. In any event, the OP has now indicated that there are actually already three floors above ground, so there is no doubt that it 'qualifies', even without counting the cellar.

Nothing to worry about for stage 1. I would suggest he gets a damp company to advise and maybe look at tanking that cellar, before other works are done.

Indeed, when it comes to the 'eventual plan' (if that proves to be viable at all), that will presumably be essential. For "Stage 1", I don't think many people would bother about (pretty expensive) tanking etc. - I am used to having to wear waterproof footware in my cellar in winter

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0T5qXGF1wWDjE

After over 3 hours, that page is still only showing this:

Do you need building control involved in that?

He will for things structural, electrical, thermal....

a fire exit from the cellar.

Why, if he doesn't need one now?

As there isn't one now, is it compulsory to have a timer installed so that he doesn't spend too long down there? Because right now that's the only difference between how he currently uses the rooms and how he plans to use them.

AIUI, if the space is not extended in any way (including lowering the floor if the ceiling height is too low) then PP isn't needed for what would be, basically, just refurbishment.

But then I am not a planner. We have a planning forum here.

 

[JohnW2]

Who said that there is currently no 'fire exit' from his cellar? As for his 'eventual plan', I would have thought that BC approval and/or PP would be required for the creation of habitable rooms in a cellar which currently does not contain any - but I may be wrong.

 

[plugwash]

What I fear is that you may be dealing with a mixture of cables supplying the cellar and cables supplying the ground floor. Which means that it may be difficult to tidy up the wiring in the cellar without digging into the walls on the ground floor.

 

[JohnW2]

What I fear is that you may be dealing with a mixture of cables supplying the cellar and cables supplying the ground floor. Which means that it may be difficult to tidy up the wiring in the cellar without digging into the walls on the ground floor.

I imagine that is very probably the case. My cellar (which, like the OPs, goes under most of my {large} house, and which no longer has any ceiling (i.e. ground floor floorboards are visible), contains a vast amount of visible wiring, but most of that relates to the ground floor rooms (everything other than lighting wiring is in the cellar), rather than to the cellar itself.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Who said that there is currently no 'fire exit' from his cellar?

True.

As for his 'eventual plan', I would have thought that BC approval

He will [need Building Control involvement] for things structural, electrical, thermal....

and/or PP would be required for the creation of habitable rooms in a cellar which currently does not contain any

What is a "habitable room"?

- but I may be wrong.

We have a planning forum here.