Support for binder in loft (Ed.)

[markyd85]

I'm boarding my loft for storage and I've found what looks like a potential issue with a binder.

It appears when the house was built the brick that was installed to support the binder broke and it's been wedged up with a small piece of wood?

Ideally would like to know what the safest method of sorting this problem out?

 

[blup]

You could fit a joist hangar, chopping off the brick and removing the wood, supporting the binder from the ceiling underneath during the works. But if there is no deflection in the ceiling, and its been like that for the life of the house (60 plus years?) why not leave it if the loft is for storage use.

Blup

 

[robinbanks]

It appears when the house was built the brick that was installed to support the binder broke and it's been wedged up with a small piece of wood?

Looks to me more like the brick was installed too low so the small block was installed to make up the difference, but was too far away from the wall and the leverage broke the brick, the small block remaining in place by chance based on where the brick snapped

If that was doing anything of consequence the end of the wood/corner of the block would be crushed/distorted by now. Hammer the small block towards the wall to vastly reduce the possibility it will fall out when you start bounding around laying boards and move on with the job; the brick appears to be demonstrating it is strong enough to take any existing load at the present point it is experiencing it

 

[markyd85]

Looks to me more like the brick was installed too low so the small block was installed to make up the difference, but was too far away from the wall and the leverage broke the brick, the small block remaining in place by chance based on where the brick snapped

If that was doing anything of consequence the end of the wood/corner of the block would be crushed/distorted by now. Hammer the small block towards the wall to vastly reduce the possibility it will fall out when you start bounding around laying boards and move on with the job; the brick appears to be demonstrating it is strong enough to take any existing load at the present point it is experiencing it

Thanks for the reply, I've got about a 3 inch gap between a ceiling joist and that wooden block. Think I'll have a right game trying to get that in a better position

 

[markyd85]

I've considered using the attached, but the hanger support again I'll have trouble as there's a brick in the way and the wooden block. The black supports I could use temporarily whilst removing the wooden block and possibly packing the space out with concrete on top of that brick?

 

[robinbanks]

Thanks for the reply, I've got about a 3 inch gap between a ceiling joist and that wooden block. Think I'll have a right game trying to get that in a better position

L shaped something (made, not bought) used like a chisel,
and/or ratchet strap the binder up to something above to lift it slightly,
and/or a prop in the room below directly under the last joist, again to lift it a small amount,
and/or long lever (hold one end, far end on joist, small block in between) or car scissor jack to push off that joist to position

It won't take much, you just need to arrange a bit of mechanical assist for yourself

If you want to sack the block and brick off, nothing stops you installing a hanger first but I would apply some lift to the binder initially, then install the hanger so that the hanger is tensioned as the lift is released rather than tensioned by the ceiling sagging beyond where it has been supported til now. I personally wouldn't bother with a hanger, just better arrange the existing support

 

[blup]

Just get the thickest joist you can fit underneath fix to the joist then screw fix to the wall, you should be able drill down at an angle. The corbelled brick was designed to take the load but will have to go unless you over engineer a design around it.

Blup

 

[markyd85]

I ended up getting some L shaped joist brackets, supported the binding with a ratchet strap and lifted it up just enough to move the piece of wood into the correct position on the brick.

I've screwed the L shaped brackets to the chimney breast using concrete screws 100mm 2 in each bracket then bolted through the binder.

It's now sitting back on the brick with added support of the brackets. Hoping it will survive another 60 years...

Thanks for the advice