In and out in one? Haha!
Jobandknock is doing a good job at telling the way I would do it.
Jobandknock is doing a good job at telling the way I would do it.
Unlevel door lining
- Thread starter Keitai
- Start date
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Deleted member 174758
Just to clarify - I was talking about getting the wood in the 'hole.......
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Deleted member 174758
The "trick" is, unfortunately, skill, judgement and experience. There are some things you can't cut corners on. But you could always try inventing something and patenting it to do the task...
One of the "techniques" used by foremen (or at least the ones who have half a brain) is to get the same guy who installs the casings to install the doors. Makes the fly by nights do the job right because if thevgapping is carp they'll need to redo it. That tends to sort the idiots out pretty quickly. Unfortunately.....
In terms of planing, whilst I use a power planer to rough out the fitting, if a lot of material needs to come off (and I often go down to.0.2mm or so), I invariably finish off with a hand plane. A sharp, well set hand plane can take a shaving so thin that it is almost transparent. It also gets rid of those horrible ribbed machining marks that power planers (except those few spiral cutter jobbies like the Festools and Portaplaners employ).
The point is that some things you will only ever learn to do right with practice
Oh yes, and maybe I didn't emphasise this enough (if at all), but you need to take an approximately even amount off the two sides (e.g.if you need 6mm off the width of a door it should be 3mm per side) and the same goes for the top and bottom as well the idea being to have the panels roughly centred on the opening and not looking like the top and bottom rails are out of proportion. On modern composite material doors you also need to ensure that you don't exceed the manufacturers recommendations on the amount you take off - the edge lippings are not very thick much if the time.
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I tried to scribe the narrow side bits of door (once jammed in)with the trend easy scribe tool but the lead kept slipping, moving and snapping. So tried the thin metal bit from this tool ( took out of tool to push into narrow gap) combined with a 10p coin or 2mm packer pushing pencil into this with my finger and had more success. It's tricky though mainly because the gap is so tight.
Another issue was the gap on hinge side was too narrow. To deal with this I put a blue 2mm packer under hinge which seemed to help. Dont know how thick you can pack hinges out mind.
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Deleted member 174758
TBH matters less initially if the fit is tight, so long as the gap is fairly consistent and doesn't exceed 3mm anywhere (or less on stamped mild steel hinges). The danger is taking off too much, too early. This is because you can always plane a millimetre or two off a door with the power planer or a jack plane (remembering to take even amounts off each side in turn to keep the door stiles looking visually alike). Hinge gap is approx 3mm for stainless steel or brass fire hinges, cheap domestic stamped steel ones are often more like 2mm or so. Check the hinges, but remember that stamped steel hinges can be swaged to reduce the gapping a bit if they are a bit "loose"
Thxs. Think I'll try and get the door tight in lining with electric planer the use jackpmane or block plane to get 3mm. I need to learn how to keep those blades sharp now. I've totally been relying on electric planer until now
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Deleted member 174758
Google "scary sharp" and look at some of the videos on YouTube. The most expensive bit of kit is probably a piece of float glass (although a granite worktop saver/chopping board like the "Malton" from Argos, 400x300mm - circa £15 - will also do fine). You also need a selection of wet and dry papers (Halfords), spray adhesive, a cheap Eclipse copy honing jig (under a tenner) and some light oil (3-in-1 or sewing machine oil whilst not ideal will suffice to start - BTW WD40 is NOT a lubricant). There are plenty of other ways to sharpen stuff but I reckon that "scary sharp" is a good starting point
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I've got this device which sets the perfect angle to hone and u push it forward and backwards with that.
I think I drilled too big a hole for the bolt through screws after not getting them lined up , the handle is now on the ****. Not straight as u can see. Anyway to rectify that?
Take the handle off then depending on what size screws youve use whittle some slow taper pegs . Then tap them in the old holes with a little wood glue.when dry refit the handle in the correct position
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Deleted member 174758
Yes, drill the right size holes in the right places in the first place!
Or you could try using your combi square to align the plate top and bottom before marking and drilling...
This can be done "after the fact" as well, but you may well need to remove the ironmongery, redrill the holes to something like 6 or 8mm diameter (standard twist drill, NOT a brad point or a spade bit - go slowly), glue in wooden dowels (softwood if you can get them, for this door, hardwood but not beech for exterior grade hardwood doors), flush trim the dowels once the glue has set and finally refit the handles and plates onto the spindle, realign each of the plates using a correctly set combi square, and then pilot, drill and screw the plates to the door, making sure that the handle works smoothly and doesn't bind.
If it helps, many locks and latches in the UK have spindle centres at 44mm (1-3/4in) or 57mm (2-1/4in) meaning that you can mark a very light pencil line down the door on both sides (if the door is not being over-painted consider running some masking tape down the door before drawing the lines, on the tape, to avoid marring the door finishes), then using a combi square to help position your handle set
Got this dowell, did u say must be hardwood? I bought soft but can get hardwood. Its diameter is 1mm too small but I have another slightly bigger one which I could trim down for a tight fit. Push it all the way through with glue right?
gripfil would take up the difference
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Deleted member 174758
I'd probably use softwood dowels on softwood and composite (chipboard core) and hardwood on hardwood doors. What I aim for is a dowel which is of similar colour and hardness to the original structure.
The fit of the dowel in the hole really needs to be very snug indeed, so I don't think that filler, excess glue with sawdust, GripFill or any other filler would be even half as effective, in part because it is just one more thing to fall out if you stress it (such as if you saw, chisel, plane, drill, screw or sand it)
Don't push all the way through unless there is no lock body in the way. If by pushing it through you would end up going through the lock body mortise, you will need to cut it and insert small "plugs" in the door, one each side, hence the need for a snug fit
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Is this any good-
https://www.workshopheaven.com/work...Vakn-Ar-DqAb3SobFuVSLgr0zbg6R__UaAmXSEALw_wcB
It sets the correct angle for honing.
Or would I be better practising freehand- found a malton board-
https://www.argos.co.uk/product/7662403
Squirt the 3 in 1 on it and do the figure of 8 , hold chisel upright and when you push it yo the right angle for honing the oil squeezes out. Never done it myself just what I watched and heard. I have no confidence and dont want to ruin my planer blades- both feel blunt to me. Maybe buy a cheap chisel to practice or just get the setting machine, what do u think ?
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Deleted member 174758
£64? Yikes! The idea was to do this on the cheap. Just add this lot up...
Granite pastry board or piece of thick (12mm plus) float glass with the edges, "safed" - £15
Selection of wet and dry (silicon carbide) papers (£5 to £8 from Halfords or off Amazon) - £5 to £8
Spray adhesive (Poundshop) - £1
Low cost honing guide, e.g Draper, etc - £5 to £8
3-in-1 oil or sewing machine oil (Poundshop although as a handyman I'd have thought you'd have had this) - £1
I make that £26 to £30.
For a start, as an absolute beginner working on your own you really don't want to go the figure of 8 route, simply because you'll end up rounding the blade over and/or getting the edge out of square to the side of the blade. I've taught enough apprentices to know that 2 out of 3 cock it up first time round (meaning that I've needed to grind it straight and start them again). In any case, figure of 8 will quite probably rip your abrasive papers to pieces - the technique is for use with sharpening stones or diamond plates. So I strongly recommend that to start with you stick with the "training wheels"
You might want to consider a Norton IB8 8x2x1in combination oilstone (100x/320x grits) or similar (don't buy cheap Chinese carp and avoid waterstones), but remember that milestones hollow over time and as a beginner you have enough to concern yourself with.
Granite pastry board or piece of thick (12mm plus) float glass with the edges, "safed" - £15
Selection of wet and dry (silicon carbide) papers (£5 to £8 from Halfords or off Amazon) - £5 to £8
Spray adhesive (Poundshop) - £1
Low cost honing guide, e.g Draper, etc - £5 to £8
3-in-1 oil or sewing machine oil (Poundshop although as a handyman I'd have thought you'd have had this) - £1
I make that £26 to £30.
For a start, as an absolute beginner working on your own you really don't want to go the figure of 8 route, simply because you'll end up rounding the blade over and/or getting the edge out of square to the side of the blade. I've taught enough apprentices to know that 2 out of 3 cock it up first time round (meaning that I've needed to grind it straight and start them again). In any case, figure of 8 will quite probably rip your abrasive papers to pieces - the technique is for use with sharpening stones or diamond plates. So I strongly recommend that to start with you stick with the "training wheels"
You might want to consider a Norton IB8 8x2x1in combination oilstone (100x/320x grits) or similar (don't buy cheap Chinese carp and avoid waterstones), but remember that milestones hollow over time and as a beginner you have enough to concern yourself with.