What functions does a radio need so that I can listen to an internet station

oldcardriver

oldcardriver

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oldcardriver said:
I know that I can listen to an internet station on my iPad or computer, but what functions does a radio need to have for me to listen to an internet station. These 2 radios are described as DAB+ digital, but can I listen to internet radio on them:-

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-XDR-S41D-Portable-Wireless-Display/dp/B073W16GK8/

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07VCG21WQ/

If someone has a link explaining the meaning of DAB+ etc, it would be useful.
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https://www.worlddab.org/public_document/file/442/DAB__Overview_2013.pdf?1394188480

Basically there are three/four delivery methods for audio.....

1 traditional FM radio
2 DAB
3 Internet
4 digital via your TV

DAB/DAB+ is delivered by radio, just like FM but on a higher frequency and delivered digitally. FM is transmitted around 100Mhz, DAB around 200Mhz, so different antennas are needed for each mode.

Internet radio requires access to the internet - either on your home wifi, or mobile phone data, but the internet allows you to listen to a massive range of 'stations' from anywhere in the world.

Digital via your TV, is delivered via digital radio, along with your digital TV channels - which usually involves a rooftop antenna for reception.

FM radio reception can be variable, depending on signal strength. It can vary from perfect to quite noisy. Digital tends to either work reasonably well, or not work at all. On or off with nothing in between, no gradual fading.

FM has some inaudible digital signal mixed with it, for various purposes, such as time and channel identification. DAB reception range tends to not be as good as FM. Audiophiles also suggest that the audio quality delivered by digital methods is not as good as the standards delivered by analogue FM delivery. Digital usually has the bitrate reduced to the minimum acceptable standard, to limit the bandwidth needed.

Finally, DAB portable battery operated radios absolutely eat batteries, when compared to FM radios. DAB radios really need to have an alternative supply to batteries.
 
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DAB+ is an upgraded version of DAB. Some stations in the UK are using DAB+ and most countries have gone over to it completely. A DAB radio will not receive DAB+, the stations will be listed but silent. A DAB+ radio will receive both DAB and DAB+. *Warning. Tesco’s and other supermarkets are still selling DAB only radios, don’t buy them.

*I seem to remember reading that Australia sold a DAB+ radio that was not compatible with DAB.

Internet radios require a WiFi connection and generally connect to a portal which provides the stations. Problem is these portals tend to get discontinued rendering the radios useless. A popular one was Receiva which closed recently. The Lounge used by Pure radios closed several years ago. Another one called TuneIn, though still operating has removed access to foreign stations due to “rights issues”.

I was a great fan of internet radio once but now having got a pile of useless radios due to the above issues I’m glad I still have my short wave radio!
 
I have tried several DAB radios, and sound quality has consistently been worse than FM.
 
JohnD said:
I have tried several DAB radios, and sound quality has consistently been worse than FM.
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It depends on the bit rate, the broadcaster vary it, depending on how much bandwidth they have available and the program content.
 
I have never had one that is as good as FM, on any station.

This might be one of the reasons why, I hear, UK has fallen below the 50% digital usage declared to trigger removal of FM service

Cost and battery life will be other reasons.
 
winston1 said:
Internet radios require a WiFi connection and generally connect to a portal which provides the stations. Problem is these portals tend to get discontinued rendering the radios useless. A popular one was Receiva which closed recently. The Lounge used by Pure radios closed several years ago. Another one called TuneIn, though still operating has removed access to foreign stations due to “rights issues”.

I was a great fan of internet radio once but now having got a pile of useless radios due to the above issues I’m glad I still have my short wave radio!
Click to expand...

Thanks very much for the explanation. I see that some radios have Spotify Connect, is that a “portal” like those that you referred to?
 
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Harry Bloomfield said:
https://www.worlddab.org/public_document/file/442/DAB__Overview_2013.pdf?1394188480

Basically there are three/four delivery methods for audio.....

1 traditional FM radio
2 DAB
3 Internet
4 digital via your TV

DAB/DAB+ is delivered by radio, just like FM but on a higher frequency and delivered digitally. FM is transmitted around 100Mhz, DAB around 200Mhz, so different antennas are needed for each mode.

Internet radio requires access to the internet - either on your home wifi, or mobile phone data, but the internet allows you to listen to a massive range of 'stations' from anywhere in the world.

Digital via your TV, is delivered via digital radio, along with your digital TV channels - which usually involves a rooftop antenna for reception.

FM radio reception can be variable, depending on signal strength. It can vary from perfect to quite noisy. Digital tends to either work reasonably well, or not work at all. On or off with nothing in between, no gradual fading.

FM has some inaudible digital signal mixed with it, for various purposes, such as time and channel identification. DAB reception range tends to not be as good as FM. Audiophiles also suggest that the audio quality delivered by digital methods is not as good as the standards delivered by analogue FM delivery. Digital usually has the bitrate reduced to the minimum acceptable standard, to limit the bandwidth needed.

Finally, DAB portable battery operated radios absolutely eat batteries, when compared to FM radios. DAB radios really need to have an alternative supply to batteries.
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^ Good post. Very comprehensive.

It may sound obvious, but for any casual readers it's important to say that an Internet radio is only going to work where someone has access to the Internet, and the radio can tap in to it. That, and Winston's point about the portals being open.

For the majority of us we'll have a home broadband service and a Wi-Fi router. Naturally then, we'll use Wi-Fi to connect the Internet radio to the router. This throws up its own question: How good is the Wi-Fi in your home?

Streaming some audio doesn't take up a lot of bandwidth. It's not a data-heavy process in the way that streaming 4K UHD is for Netflix or Amazon Prime videos. This means that al lot of the Internet radio manufacturers go "low rent" with their Wi-Fi connection. You see, there are two frequency bands for domestic Wi-Fi: 2.4GHz which supports wireless standards 802.11-b, g and n. Then there's 5GHz which supports wireless standards 802.11n and ac.

The 2.4GHz frequency band is really quite congested. It's also prone to interference from noise sources such as DECT cordless house phones and microwave ovens when they're running. These and other noise sources can temporarily jam a 2.4GHz Wi-Fi connection. The 5GHz frequency is far less congested, but guess which frequency many of the Internet radios use for Wi-Fi...... Yep, 2.4GHz.

To be fair, 2.4GHz does have better range than 5GHz, and if the radio is fitted with a decent buffer memory then it can withstand some breaks in the Wi-Fi service without interrupting music playback. But it's worth earing in mind if you do find your Internet radio losing connection.

A follow-on point from this is whether your router has 2.4GHz transmissions switched on. I have come across some wireless routers where it is disabled in the default settings, and so if you're struggling to get a connection at all then it might be worth checking that 2.4GHz is active.


Internet radios aren't the only choice of hardware for music streaming, but they do offer alternative tuning services such as FM and DAB/DAB+. Some also have line input connections, and this opens up the possibility of connecting a smartphone or smart speaker puck such as an Amazon Echo Dot using a simple 3.5mm jack to jack cable. Of course, the other alternative is just to go for a smart speaker.
 
I used to connect my phone to the car radio by Bluetooth and then listen to internet radio via the 3/4G mobile connection.
 
On site, if working on scaffolding for example, I use an IP rated bluetooth speaker and stream Radio 4 to it (over the internet and via Bluetooth) using my phone.

An advantage is that I can play podcasts such as You're Dead to Me, Evil Genius. AFAIK, you can't do that with Internet enabled radios.
 
I love my internet radio, the choice is endless with thousands of stations to choose from, if you just want to pick and choose and listen to an internet station you can't get simpler than a standalone internet radio.
 
It's a little off topic, but we get a really raw deal in the UK with DAB and DAB+.

We've had DAB in the UK now for a little over a quarter of a century. It's surprising to think that DAB has been around so long. The UK was one of the early adopters, and as such we're now stuck with the antiquated DAB standard because of the need to maintain backwards compatibility with all the DAB radios in circulation. Late-adopter countries such as Germany skipped DAB and went directly for DAB+. It's far more efficient and so can produce high quality audio using far less bandwidth than DAB.

If you look at quite a lot of the German DAB+ radio stations, they're broadcasting at DAB+ rates that are as good as CD audio. This brings me to the second point of contention; audio quality. In the UK we get screwed. The UK broadcasters went down the 'quantity before quality' route which is why DAB and DAB+ sound pants here. There are a few sites that rate DAB bit rates against othere audio formats. Our average transmissions compare to cassette down to AM radio. That's appalling.

The word audiophile is thrown around as a pejorative term, and maybe there's this mental image of someone who has to spend obscene amounts of money on equipment. That's not really an audiophile; its a description of an audio snob. We get snobs in all walks of life. There are the owners of performance cars who have them for pose value. Or the family with the new kitchen full of gadgets they don't understand or rarely use. These are snobs, and audio has its fair share of them too.

In truth, an audiophile is anyone who asks the question "Is this the best I can get for my money?" That's it; just as simple as that.

It's not about high-end, or golden ears, or any of the other preconceived notions that tend to revolve around Hi-Fi snobbery and the snake oil industry. It's the simple act of asking whether a bit of kit does a decent job of playing music. The budget itself is largely irrelevant so long as it's realistic.

Coming back to DAB and DAB+ sound quality in the UK, you don't need golden ears to hear the difference them and FM. I was playing with the radio in a 2020 Skoda Kodiaq whilst parked up. FM sounded richer and with more body than DAB. When driving though the differences were flattened out due to in-cabin noise.
 
freddiemercurystwin said:
I love my internet radio, the choice is endless with thousands of stations to choose from, if you just want to pick and choose and listen to an internet station you can't get simpler than a standalone internet radio.
Click to expand...

Other than wi-fi what else do I need to look for in the spec? How does it search for stations, will it have an address bar to search for stations like a computer? I am a totally ignorant of how these things work.
 
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