Earthing a chrome light switch

[EFLImpudence]

My statement was short, simple and logically unarguable.


The question, though, is - DO you need to have lunch? If not, then you do not need to have lunch.

Do you need to earth a backbox? No. Therefore you do not need to earth a backbox, so saying you need to earth a backbox is incorrect.

 

[JohnW2]

The question, though, is - DO you need to have lunch? If not, then you do not need to have lunch.

As I said, it depends what meaning one ascribes to the word. Dictionaries offer a variety of meanings.

I presume that you don't deny that the sort of example statements I gave are extremely common in everyday English. Are you expressing the opinion that all this (very) common usage is incorrect - so that, for example, I should never say that I 'need' to mow my lawn?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

It depends, doesn't it?

Everyday English is not really a determining factor until unfortunately too late when everyone is wrong. Let's stop the rot.


need

1. require (something) because it is essential or very important rather than just desirable.
   
2. expressing necessity or obligation.
   
3. be necessary.
   

None would seem to apply to the backbox - and 1. rules out the relevance of 'IMO'.

Have you a more modern definition which has been modified to suit your need?


I don't think "I 'need' to mow my lawn" is a good example unless something untoward would happen to YOU if you did not do it.

"The lawn 'needs' mowing" might be more appropriate but actually the lawn doesn't care so...


Anyway, it does not apply to backboxes so thinking of other tenuous examples is not helpful.

 

[JohnW2]

need

1. require (something) because it is essential or very important rather than just desirable.
2. expressing necessity or obligation.
3. be necessary.​

​

(2) is interesting, since it's the one that BAS majored on. However, none of the examples given in the OED really indicate any "connotation of compulsion" such as BAS was suggesting. I think that if the intention were to convey the concept of compulsion, most people would probably use "must" (or maybe the somewhat weaker "should"), not "need".

None would seem to apply to the backbox - and 1. rules out the relevance of 'IMO'.

Not necessarily. I realise that opinions vary, but "in my personal opinion" a flylead is more than merely 'desirable'.

I don't think "I 'need' to mow my lawn" is a good example unless something untoward would happen to YOU if you did not do it.

That's really my point. I imagine that thousands of people across the UK will, at some point over this weekend, say "I need to mow the lawn", or something very similar, despite the fact that nothing is going to happen to any of them if they don't do it.

I know you don't like 'common usage', but if one wants to communicate with the population who use it, one really has to accept that 'they mean what they mean'!

Kind Regards, John

 

[cwhaley]

While this site is fantastic purely due to the level of skill and helpfulness on it, it never ceases to amaze me how even the most simple of posts can (and often do) descend into a fully-fledged debate! No disrespect to anybody, but in the past when I have searched for a problem it usually starts with the question and 5 pages of arguments and quotes. Somewhere within those 5 pages will be the answer.

As an updated - I ran about 3" of new earthing cable to the faceplate, tidied up inside the back box and with new screws got a nice flush fit on the wall. Switches work fine, looks nice and smart and I'm happy knowing I did a little extra to make it safe.

 

[sparkwright]

The electrical forum is very thorough, and safety and good practice is paramount.

There's no question that earthing the back box directly as well as the faceplate has made it that little bit safer.

And yes, a simple question here can turn into pages and pages of only loosely related material and possibly the start of WW3.

 

[mwatsonxx]

While this site is fantastic purely due to the level of skill and helpfulness on it, it never ceases to amaze me how even the most simple of posts can (and often do) descend into a fully-fledged debate! No disrespect to anybody, but in the past when I have searched for a problem it usually starts with the question and 5 pages of arguments and quotes. Somewhere within those 5 pages will be the answer.

As an updated - I ran about 3" of new earthing cable to the faceplate, tidied up inside the back box and with new screws got a nice flush fit on the wall. Switches work fine, looks nice and smart and I'm happy knowing I did a little extra to make it safe.

But did you use a torque wrench? and what torque setting.