Expanded ULEZ

diy_fun_uk said:
folk don't want to give up their cars.
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No one is asking anyone to give up their car though. I enjoy driving and will continue to do so.

Sensationalists, and I'm not including you, like to bandy words about which could not be further from the truth. It makes a good headline though...
 
denso13 said:
No one is asking anyone to give up their car though. I enjoy driving and will continue to do so.

Sensationalists, and I'm not including you, like to bandy words about which could not be further from the truth. It makes a good headline though...
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If these schemes become the norm, people that can just about afford to run a car (and require to enter chargeable zones) will either need to stop entering said zones or give up their car altogether. It's a logical point to make, any policy/strategy that includes a chargeable element doesn't penalise those who can easily absorb said charges, it penalises those who can't.
 
diy_fun_uk said:
If these schemes become the norm, people that can just about afford to run a car (and require to enter chargeable zones) will either need to stop entering said zones or give up their car altogether. It's a logical point to make, any policy/strategy that includes a chargeable element doesn't penalise those who can easily absorb said charges, it penalises those who can't.
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To hard for him too compute that.
 
diy_fun_uk said:
and require to enter chargeable zones
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Emission zones aren't chargeable for use as such, but you can get fined if you use an old polluting car. For example Glasgow's will normally be free for diesels under 8 years old and petrol cars under 17 years old. Other than that, park and ride for a few miles for very little. That's a small price to pay for cleaning up the air we breathe (which isn't taxed).

Some think that means we are somehow being walled in with our freedoms removed.
 
diy_fun_uk said:
I often pop down to mum's mid week for a visit after work. It goes something like this:

Car Journey
17.30: Walk out of my house.
17.50: Walk into mums house.

20.00: Walk out of mums house.
20.20: Walk into my house.

A quick look at the bus timetable tells me the journey would be something like this:

Bus Journey
17.30: Leave my house for bus stop.
17.41: Get on bus.
18.21: Get off bus.
18.30: Arrive at mums house.

20.00: Leave mums house for bus stop.
20.16: Get on bus.
20.46: Get off bus.
20.59: Get on another bus.
21.18: Get off bus.
21.25: Arrive at my house.

Summary, by car takes 20 mins door to door and I have approx. 2 hours to natter with mum. By bus I have 1.5 hours to natter, however the journey there takes approx. 60 mins and coming back almost 1.5 hours with a change of bus along the way. Not to mention inclement weather, undesirables that might be hanging about in the evening etc.

And they wonder why, in many day to day scenarios, folk don't want to give up their cars.
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How far is it?

For what it's worth that implies that you'd be fine if you were in a 15 minute city scenario as it's further away than 15 minutes travel can get you. Which means you'd be fine to drive more or less as you are.

But yes the bus services in everywhere except London are crap.
 
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These 15 minute cities are something you can either do by walking or cycling.
 
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gant said:
Cars are out, they're designed on how far you can walk or cycle in 15 minutes.
You not know that, time for a rethink?
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The idea is that everything you need on a routine basis, Doctors, shops, schools etc. should be within 15 minutes walk. That doesn't mean everything has to be within 15 minutes walk/public transit. The idea is to reduce the need to drive, not stop all driving.

@diy_fun_uk 's mum probably doesn't count. <Insert childish joke here>
 
IT Minion said:
The idea is that everything you need on a routine basis, Doctors, shops, schools etc. should be within 15 minutes walk. That doesn't mean everything has to be within 15 minutes walk/public transit. The idea is to reduce the need to drive, not stop all driving.

@diy_fun_uk 's mum probably doesn't count. <Insert childish joke here>
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Marvellous, any gamboling lambs involved in this dream?.
Can see a lot of people being trapped in a nightmare not of their own making in our cities and towns if these restrictions ever come to fruition, or are you another like Denso who doesn't think the consequences through.
 
In order provide services within 15 minutes. We clearly create huge logistic and duplication of service issues.

Imagine how much it would cost to have 10 small hospitals providing services that are currently provided by 1 large one.
- Capacity cannot be distributed across the 10 sites effectively
- Duplication of services like security, dispensing, reception, IT, maintenance, HR, Finance etc.
- You have to provide services where there is no economy of demand.
- Delivering service, maintenance supplies etc etc. to 10 sites is vastly more costly
- Even HVAC will cost more, heating and cooling sparsely occupied buildings

I'm guessing the orchestrators haven't considered this in their utopian vision.

replace "hospital", with almost anything else and the same rules apply. There is a reason Supermarkets replaced high street grocers.
 
denso13 said:
You are claiming cars will be banned, not me. Prove it yerself.
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No i didn't, your getting like notchy inventing things. Any Google search describes the distance involved by the criteria of walking or cycling.
It's quite obvious you'll still have your car, how much use it'll be is open to debate.
 
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