New Boiler and new bathroom. What would you suggest in term of brands

[bernardgreen]

Keep in mind that an unvented cylinder needs an annual service, and when parts fail then

Keep in mind that a combi boiler also needs an annual service, and when parts fail then you have no heating or hot water.

With a non-combi boiler and cylinder with an immersion heater you still have hot water while waiting for the boiler to be repaired

 

[hard-work]

Keep in mind that a combi boiler also needs an annual service, and when parts fail then you have no heating or hot water.

With an unvented cylinder you have two annual service costs - the boiler and the cylinder. When the cylinders go wrong they are not cheap to repair.

If you really want full backup - heating & DHW - install a second cheap combi with an electric main throw-over switch and small relay, so both cannot be on at the same time. The same wall stat can be used for both via the relay. I saw a BIASI Riva for £170 on a B&Q deal. Great for whole house backup. Would rarely be used so can be a cheapie job.

 

[DP]

Despite The name is not well know I got a good feeling with ATAG. From their website and plumber description seem like a solid and innovative piece of equipment.

Wish I knew fraction of what VC has forgotten
If you do not want good advice, go with your gut feeling then

 

[Jonny Vee]

Wish I knew fraction of what VC has forgotten
If you do not want good advice, go with your gut feeling then

What are you talking about I do not think to have never said to avoid good advice otherwise I was not going to ask on this forum. Before jumping to conclusion please read the all discussion.

 

[ianmcd]

What are you talking about I do not think to have never said to avoid good advice otherwise I was not going to ask on this forum. Before jumping to conclusion please read the all discussion.

I work on Atags and I really like them, spares are hard to get though if you need them, what Vulcan is saying they are a very young company in the UK and that WB has fantastic support, but in my humble opinion not great boilers, however if you do go down the WB route then keep your boiler serviced every year to keep the warranty valid, and should you need them them their after sales service is excellent, all installers have their own preferances and for a range of reasons, but if you have an installer that you have a good relationship with and trust them, then go with what they recommend, I always fit a particular brand because I have a good long standing relationship with the company and I know that should I need anything I know who to call

 

[hard-work]

ATAG have been in the UK for around 20 years. Most installers fit a particular type/make of boiler mainly because they make more money on that than others and they understand the error codes/know how to fit/fix it quickly. Most do not care how long they last, how they are designed inside, quality of materials, or how reliable they are, as long as they last the guarantee, then they are out of it.

If installers went on reliability and longevity, Intergas and ATAG would dominate the market, especially Intergas.

Installers also fit known brands to cover themselves. The customers have heard of Vaillant and Worcester Bosch, so they fit them. If problems they say "we fitted a quality brand" - even though the installation is poorly installed, not flushed, full of elbows giving water noises, all the house teed off one 15mm cold water main pipe, inc combi when fitting a combi, etc.

 

[hard-work]

Wish I knew fraction of what VC has forgotten
If you do not want good advice, go with your gut feeling then

I have had a number of ATAGs fitted, quality without doubt. Now Intergas are upping their combi flowrates the leaning is towards them. One ATAG is now 10 years old, one of the first with flue gas heat recovery, a 15 litr/min combi. The customer I found out recently never had it serviced in 10 years, and yet has been fault free. W-B have good service because they need it. Look at the Junior! What junk. The new version has a rubber gas pipe inside. Yes, rubber, that just pushes on. Shishhhhhh

 

[DP]

I have had a number of ATAGs fitted, quality without doubt. Now Intergas are upping their combi flowrates the leaning is towards them. One ATAG is now 10 years old, one of the first with flue gas heat recovery, a 15 litr/min combi. The customer I found out recently never had it serviced in 10 years, and yet has been fault free. W-B have good service because they need it. Look at the Junior! What junk. The new version has a rubber gas pipe inside. Yes, rubber, that just pushes on. Shishhhhhh

Hard work, I mainly do repairs, have fitted several Intergas boilers. I dread the day I will need to repair these as parts are not as easily got as the mainstream boilers, then at a price. If you go into the Combustion Chamber, there is a post by one of the regulars about the Atag

I as a repairer need to know how boiler I am at, works and what kind of issues are liable to occur. Valcan Continental is a Vokera trainer of solid standing. He does not push his boiler, but any advice from this gent is gold plated.

 

[Ethel H]

I have had personal experience of an open vented thermal store in an apartment for 8 years and I am glad I switched to an unvented cylinder. What the sales brochures don't mention about thermal stores, but the installation manuals do, are the various components you need to install with the thermal store.

The problems with the thermal store I had were
1) The PCB board (control panel) failed regularly.
2) The plate heat exchanger blocked up with limescale because of the narrow waterways
3) The (pwm) motorised pump would fail due to sludge as it is open vented.
4) There was a small Feed and Expansion tank sitting on top of the thermal store that we had to manually top up with water due to natural evaporation. If we failed to remember to top it up, the whole thermal store would fail.

We had to arrange regular engineer call outs to fix our thermal store and the engineer often had to replace more than one component because he replaced the wrong component the first time due to misdiagnosis. The thermal store had intermittent faults and it was hard to diagnose at times despite the fault codes flashing on the PCB board.

When we switched to unvented cylinder it was incredible because it had none of the above components to worry about. We never had a call out for 7 years. We never had it serviced although the manufacturer recommends that we do annually to maintain the warranty. There is no legal requirement to have an annual service, even for a landlord renting to tenants.

There are several safety devices that are legally required to be fitted with unvented cylinders so if one safety device fails, there will be another to protect you. They are considered the safe hot water heater of choice across Europe and USA.

I am sure thermal stores have their uses with wood-fuelled boilers, heat pumps, wind energy and solar panel systems but if you want a straightforward water heater with minimal maintenance costs or one to go with your gas boiler, I would recommend an unvented hot water cylinder.

 

[dilalio]

I have had a number of ATAGs fitted, quality without doubt. Now Intergas are upping their combi flowrates the leaning is towards them. One ATAG is now 10 years old, one of the first with flue gas heat recovery, a 15 litr/min combi. The customer I found out recently never had it serviced in 10 years, and yet has been fault free. W-B have good service because they need it. Look at the Junior! What junk. The new version has a rubber gas pipe inside. Yes, rubber, that just pushes on. Shishhhhhh

So why don't you finally inform all of us, what it is you do!
And it might help if you were to desist badmouthing installers... Not all are the same, as you seem to think, neither are all of the people that do what you do.

 

[dilalio]

I work on Atags and I really like them, spares are hard to get though if you need them

Find out who the TPM is for your area and give him/her a call. They can usually hook you up with spares pronto.

I have an Atag ICE35 and it's a great boiler... DHW supply is really good and along with efficiency, is why I went for it... 3 showers in my home and it serves 2 of those simultaneously at an acceptable flow rate... obviously better when only 1 running.

 

[hard-work]

Hard work, I mainly do repairs, have fitted several Intergas boilers. I dread the day I will need to repair these as parts are not as easily got as the mainstream boilers, then at a price.

Parts are easily got. Next delivery. There are few parts in them anyhow.

 

[hard-work]

I have had personal experience of an open vented thermal store in an apartment for 8 years and I am glad I switched to an unvented cylinder.

Most of what you types was simply garbage. Vented DHW only thermal stores are simple.

1. A DHW immersed coil.
2. A blending valve
3. A thermostat.
4. An integral or separate F&E tank.

That is about it. You bought a crap one. Look at the expensive pressure valves and expansion vessel garbage on unvented cylinders. A annual service needed as well. Then only G3 men can touch them. Plumbers fit them because they want the repeat business in the future when they go wrong, which they will do, which is totally dishonest - or they know no better. How can they sludge up if they are not connected to the radiators? Well they cannot. As I wrote plumbers just don't understand them.

 

[hard-work]

And it might help if you were to desist badmouthing installers...

I report what I see, in specification and quality, of which both generally are sadly lacking.

 

[hard-work]

I switched to an unvented cylinder.

One of these, a combination cylinder:
https://www.tradeplumbing.co.uk/gle...ffz_Dp2is5Px0Bqxmbst9EaAl1zEALw_wcB&sel=47082

Have a combi heat one of these combination cylinders, with only the high pressure shower off the combi. Delivers exactly what an unvented cylinder delivers with low pressure with a low risk of an explosion. Simple and cheap. No repeat lucrative business in replacing expensive defective pressure gear for shark plumbers though.