Justified?

[Koolpc]

Where should they hide? It's not as if they've got much room to work in.

Hamas is responsible for the murder and deaths of Israelis, and some Palestinians as well as they're not exactly nice people.

Israel is responsible for every weapon they fire into Gaza. They don't get to blame Hamas for their actions. They choose how and when they respond and they seem to be choosing ethnic cleansing at first glance.

Dont be blind. Hamas are responsible. They hide amongst the people. They use them as shields. They are cowardly terrorist scum..

 

[IT Minion]

Dont be blind. Hamas are responsible. They hide amongst the people. They use them as shields. They are cowardly terrorist scum..

Mostly true, but very simplistic. Just because Hamas are disgusting it doesn't excuse Israel their actions.

Should we have shelled Catholic areas in Northern Ireland, called in airstrikes or forced all Catholics to leave NI?

 

[Roy Bloom]

Dont be blind. Hamas are responsible. They hide amongst the people. They use them as shields. They are cowardly terrorist scum..

When you have over 2 million people squeezed into about 350 km², there isn't much option.
It would be utter madness to fight Israel from the beaches, and that's about the only space that is not inhabited, in Gaza.
it's typical propaganda put out by Israel.

 

[Koolpc]

Mostly true, but very simplistic. Just because Hamas are disgusting it doesn't excuse Israel their actions.

Should we have shelled Catholic areas in Northern Ireland, called in airstrikes or forced all Catholics to leave NI?

War is terrible.

How do you expect Israel to get to hamas when they are hiding amongst them?

The people are getting warnings from Israel but hamas are holding them back. Using them as shields.

The blood is all over the hands of the cowardly hamas.

 

[Roy Bloom]

Wat is terrible.

How do you expect Israel to get to hamas when they are hiding amongst them?

The people are getting warnings from Israel but hamas are holding them back. Using them as shields.

The blood is all over the hands of the cowardly hamas.

You'll believe anything the Israelis tell you.
And God promised them the Levant.

 

[fillyboy]

It would be utter madness to fight Israel from the beaches, and that's about the only space that is not inhabited, in Gaza.
it's typical propaganda put out by Israel.

Plus agricultural land, they are after all an exporter of fruit.

Don't believe everything the terrorist scum tell you Roy.

 

[Roy Bloom]

Plus agricultural land, they are after all an exporter of fruit.

Don't believe everything the terrorist scum tell you Roy.

Abdelkarim Wahdan, a local Palestinian farmer from the northern Gazan town of Beit Hanoun, ... his rented 30-acre farm – one kilometre away from the border with Israel. (tanks can fire for up to 3 kilometers )
.... But after the Second Intifada broke out in 2000, and Israel's frequent bombings, it's been difficult," Abdelkarim told The New Arab.

https://www.newarab.com/features/farmers-gaza-begin-enjoy-fruits-their-labour#:~:text=Throughout the Gaza Strip, which,dates and most recently watermelons.

So the Israelis expect Hamas to fight from the fields and the beaches. so their tanks can manouvre easily, and their tanks can hit them from 2 kilometres inside Israel, and they can use the largest bombs available?
The Israelis are simply making excuses for obliterating all the buildings in Gaza, including schools, refugee camps and hospitals.


This round of conflict was always simmering away ready to boil over, due to the continued subjugation of the Palestinians by the Israelis.
And how the Israelis didn't know about the 7 October in advance defies logic.

Five armed Palestinian groups joined Hamas in the deadly 7 October attack on Israel after training together in military-style exercises from 2020 onwards, BBC News analysis shows.
The exercises were reported on in Israel, so it's inconceivable they were not being closely monitored by the country's extensive intelligence agencies.

How Hamas built a force to attack Israel on 7 October

BBC Arabic and BBC Verify have pieced together how armed groups came together to train for the assault.

www.bbc.com

 

[IT Minion]

Wat is terrible.

How do you expect Israel to get to hamas when they are hiding amongst them?

The people are getting warnings from Israel but hamas are holding them back. Using them as shields.

The blood is all over the hands of the cowardly hamas.

War is terrible, but Hamas' actions don't give Israel a free pass to do whatever it likes and it definitely doesn't mean they can't be judged if they break international law.

'They started it' isn't an acceptable excuse for five year olds. It's definitely not a good enough excuse for starving five year olds of water, food and medicine.

Israel can, within the law, kill civilians to hit Hamas' fighters. It's a grey area and Israel is very practiced in it. But cutting off supplies to Gaza and saying they want to drive every Palestinian out is not a response to Hamas', that is ethnic cleansing.

 

[Koolpc]

War is terrible, but Hamas' actions don't give Israel a free pass to do whatever it likes and it definitely doesn't mean they can't be judged if they break international law.

'They started it' isn't an acceptable excuse for five year olds. It's definitely not a good enough excuse for starving five year olds of water, food and medicine.

Israel can, within the law, kill civilians to hit Hamas' fighters. It's a grey area and Israel is very practiced in it. But cutting off supplies to Gaza and saying they want to drive every Palestinian out is not a response to Hamas', that is ethnic cleansing.

Hamas have deserted the ordinary person. They have out them in the firing line.

Hamas control a lot of the narrative that comes out of Gaza. Dont be fooled by it like the people in the streets demonstrating...

 

[IT Minion]

Hamas have deserted the ordinary person. They have out them in the firing line.

Hamas control a lot of the narrative that comes out of Gaza. Dont be fooled by it like the people in the streets demonstrating...

Israel and Hamas' are both very unreliable sources. For what it's worth the casualty figures coming out of Gaza are believed to be accurate by most external parties.

If you believed Israel had killed 15,000 people, including 6,000 children, would that change your view of their behaviour?

We do know that this is the most deadly conflict in decades for UN workers and journalists and that Israel has unloaded more munitions in less than two months than the peak of the war in Afghanistan did in a year.

 

[Roy Bloom]

Hamas have deserted the ordinary person. They have out them in the firing line.

Hamas control a lot of the narrative that comes out of Gaza. Dont be fooled by it like the people in the streets demonstrating...

In the 2002, when the Israelis launched an attack on the Jenin refugee camp, 52 Pal;estinians were killed, half of them civilians.
Jenin is in the West Bank. There wouldn't have been any Hamas fighters there.
The buildings were bulldozed, people were massacred.
There was goling to be a UN independent investigation, but Israel with the help of USA blocked it. (US wanted to go into Iraq, so didn't want the conflict to escalate. It would have done after a UN independent investigation into Israel conduct.)
They were concerned about IDF soldiers being found guilty of war crimes.

Killing civilians and bulldosing buildings has been a MO for IDF for decades. They invent the stroy about Hamas hiding amomng civilians as an excuse to kill civilians and destroy homes.

 

[Roy Bloom]

We do know that this is the most deadly conflict in decades for UN workers and journalists and that Israel has unloaded more munitions in less than two months than the peak of the war in Afghanistan did in a year.

They're using a US stockpile kept in Israel for use in Ukraine.

 

[fillyboy]

So the Israelis expect Hamas to fight from the fields and the beaches.

You said they didn't have any fields.

 

[Odds]

In the first four days of the ongoing truce between Israel and Hamas, which began on Friday, Israel released 150 Palestinian prisoners – 117 children and 33 women. Hamas released 69 captives – 51 Israelis and 18 people from other nations.

Over the same four days, Israel arrested at least 133 Palestinians from East Jerusalem and the West Bank, according to Palestinian prisoner associations.

Allahu Akhbar@Al Jazeera

(Truly, the Lord giveth and yet he taketh away, ye verily and forsooth.)

 

[Roy Bloom]

You said they didn't have any fields.

I didn't, I said that the fields had a wall built on them, and much of the remaining agricultural land had been defended by automatic, sensor-activated machine guns, and/or is bombed, so couldn't be used.

The report that I presented previously bears this out:

Dated 2023
Farmers in Gaza are often the worst affected when Israel attacks.
"I've been here since 1984, farming citrus fruits. But after the Second Intifada broke out in 2000, and Israel's frequent bombings, it's been difficult," Abdelkarim told The New Arab.
In 2006, Israel's attack on the Gaza Strip caused the enclave's main power plant to shut down. Since then, power outrages for at least eight hours occur daily.
"When Israel attacks [Gaza], I can't travel to my farm. Two years ago, in 2021, 10.5 cares of watermelons were destroyed because I wasn't able to irrigate my fruits for eleven consecutive days," Abdelkarim added.
Abdelkarim also shared that, in 2014, when Israel bombed Gaza for 50 days during Operation Protective Edge, he had to move most of his crops out of the farm as Israeli tanks bulldozed his crops and uprooted his land.

Farmers in Gaza begin to enjoy the fruits of their labour

Farmers in Gaza are often the worst affected when Israel attacks. But with the help of international collaboration, Palestinian farmers are now reaping the rewards of their work with new technology and protective equipment increasing productivity.

www.newarab.com

Further and additional reports provide extra detail.

Dated 2021
Gaza's battered ecosystem reels after relentless Israeli onslaughts
Whilst Gaza's most recent confrontation ended in May, it has since left environmental damage that will affect the health of humans, animals, and plants for years to come. This is especially the case in the north of the Gaza Strip.
The Water and Environmental Quality Authority and the Ministry of Agriculture in the Gaza Strip blamed the Israeli authorities for the consequences and repercussions of serious environmental pollution, which is particularly severe in the Beit Lahia municipality area in northern Gaza.
During the most recent onslaught, Israeli airstrikes targeted and bombed a group of large warehouses that supply agricultural products such as fertilisers, pesticides and plastic. After being shelled, their combustion has led to corrosive and toxic-contaminated waste.
The consequences of this catastrophe are clear: the waste will leak into the aquifer and contaminate water and soil. Meanwhile, the government in Gaza doesn't have the capabilities to transport this contaminated soil or deal with it safely.

Gaza's battered ecosystem reels after Israeli onslaughts

Gaza's reliance against Israel's bombardments is well-known, but human costs of the Israeli blockade are prolonged by a environmental landscape struggling to be revived. As arguably Gaza's most reliable life-source, what will happen next?

www.newarab.com