G
Goldspoon
Just to clarify: the 600mm only applies to freestanding stoves and not those in a fireplace recess. stovefittersmanual.co.uk
HETAS Engineers a bunch of lying so and so's....
- Thread starter mbga9pgf
- Start date
No scaremongering here! It's a pre-requisite now from certain mortgage lenders that for particular mortgage products if there is a solid fuel element to a property the bank/building society WILL NOT lend the money unless BC/HETAS evidence is in situ.
This is how I connected a 6" flue to an 8" refractory clay liner.
It's just a big heavy duty compression ring cut from 16mm plate.
14mm fire rope forms the seal which is squeezed into the recess by the 20mm bolts.
The register plate is solid concrete.
It's just a big heavy duty compression ring cut from 16mm plate.
14mm fire rope forms the seal which is squeezed into the recess by the 20mm bolts.
The register plate is solid concrete.
Just had a Twin Wall system installed and already think I have been done in terms of Flue-System cost and system design considerations.
The Team fitted roughly 4 meters of MidTherm twin-wall tube, bottom support bracket, 2 wall brackets and a 45 Deg Elbow plus a straight and 45Deg Elbow from Stove to join Twin System.
Notes: The internal fit looks "Neat" but the join from Single to Twin is within the Cavity and hence No cavity liner?
No Cleaning ' Inspection plate out-side of building?
Views please on design and by the way the small amount of Flue cost me circa £1200!!!
The Team fitted roughly 4 meters of MidTherm twin-wall tube, bottom support bracket, 2 wall brackets and a 45 Deg Elbow plus a straight and 45Deg Elbow from Stove to join Twin System.
Notes: The internal fit looks "Neat" but the join from Single to Twin is within the Cavity and hence No cavity liner?
No Cleaning ' Inspection plate out-side of building?
Views please on design and by the way the small amount of Flue cost me circa £1200!!!
Another year perfect running with no issues and DIY sweep which couldnt be easier.
You could negate the NCS by filling the stove with concrete and stating its for visual effect only. ie a "stove" is not a stove unless it is capable of combustion. OK it's a stupid comment but so's 90% of legal jargon.
- Joined
- 13 Dec 2007
- Messages
- 4,009
- Reaction score
- 661
- Country
Get them back and tell them to do it properly... There should be a cavity liner and you can't have a joint inside a wall... There should be provision for sweeping outside..... Price was cheap though.
I understand what you are saying, I now have to replace a flue liner due to using smokeless fuel and the quotes are a rip off £1000.00 is the lowest. First quote £1250.00 + VAT. I know how easy it is and how long it takes and how much the top quality flue liner costs (HETAS approved £320.00 for 10m) and the quote does not justify the work involved. The people defending the cost have lost any idea of the average mans earnings. I will quite willingly pay an registered electrician or a plumber etc the usual hourly rate but this does not equate. I have all the same issues as yourself realising I could do this using a builder for fixing at the top and seal it at the bottom myself (I am no good on a roof). No HETAS engineer will allow you to buy the Liner etc yourself because they wont be able to rip you off by doubling the price and I do understand overheads but not to this extent. They know you need the paperwork.
I know this quote is a bit old, it just really winds me up when I see unfortunate situations like this, so I thought I'd let you all know the actual position (HETAS won't like this 
)
That's the spin by HETAS! (and they'd like to keep it that way), they AREN'T a legal body, they are just a certifying body
You can have Building Control sign off a flue that a competent person (which could be you) has installed, or any one of these bodies can have 'competent' people certified for solid fuel:
"A person registered by Ascertiva Group Limited (NICEIC/Elecsa), Association of Plumbing and Heating Contractors (Certification) Limited, Benchmark Certification Limited, Building Engineering Services Competence Accreditation Limited, ECA Certification Limited, HETAS Limited or NAPIT Registration Limited in respect of that type of work."
How do I know? - we're with NAPIT
Here's the extract from the Building Regs:
)That's the spin by HETAS! (and they'd like to keep it that way), they AREN'T a legal body, they are just a certifying body
You can have Building Control sign off a flue that a competent person (which could be you) has installed, or any one of these bodies can have 'competent' people certified for solid fuel:
"A person registered by Ascertiva Group Limited (NICEIC/Elecsa), Association of Plumbing and Heating Contractors (Certification) Limited, Benchmark Certification Limited, Building Engineering Services Competence Accreditation Limited, ECA Certification Limited, HETAS Limited or NAPIT Registration Limited in respect of that type of work."
How do I know? - we're with NAPIT
Here's the extract from the Building Regs:
I need a hetas engineer to test my chimney for gas leaks as a requirement for b c regs
My email address is : [email protected]
My email address is : [email protected]
mbga9pgf - You are a smug dude, I can see why others object to your attitude, but I do see your point: the BCO can't see much now. It would have been better to notify first, but I have been told (by a HETAS lecturer) that it is allowed to notify on completion, and, even if you sell you can always stick a candle in the stove and claim it is purely decorative I guess. How many houses out there have electrical records on file, and gas records on file? Probably fairly few, the stove has "always been there, honest gov'ner".
As for safety, I was born in the Italian Dolomites, and the only solid fuel used there is wood. Beech is preferred, but spruce has 'a lot of heat in its sap' and is used.
You can buy things that split the stovepipe into six smaller bores for a section, to allow greater heat output! The stovepipe is almost always installed spigot down, as smoke rises, and is generally of tin can thickness with restrictive folded corner bends. It is considered good to have horizontal runs to get more heat from the flue. Sweeping chimneys seems to be a DIY job, and I was considered innovative for wanting a steel-bladed sweeps brush rather than a tree to sweep the chimney with. It is not unusual for appliances to share chimney flues!
Stoves tend to be made in Italy, which means they seem to be of a lesser standard than English/Danish stoves and are often not designed to be airtight, relying on chimney draught not to leak.
Smoke or CO alarms are unheard of over there.
Chimney fires are common, but chimneys are often twin walled concrete, or hollow brick which tends to resist heat better than our soft reds etc. Nearly everyone burns wood, yet I have never known anyone there to kill themselves.
So if you have followed ADJ to the best of your belief and amateur understanding, you'll probably be on this forum again in the spring to let us know you're still alive
As for safety, I was born in the Italian Dolomites, and the only solid fuel used there is wood. Beech is preferred, but spruce has 'a lot of heat in its sap' and is used.
You can buy things that split the stovepipe into six smaller bores for a section, to allow greater heat output! The stovepipe is almost always installed spigot down, as smoke rises, and is generally of tin can thickness with restrictive folded corner bends. It is considered good to have horizontal runs to get more heat from the flue. Sweeping chimneys seems to be a DIY job, and I was considered innovative for wanting a steel-bladed sweeps brush rather than a tree to sweep the chimney with. It is not unusual for appliances to share chimney flues!
Stoves tend to be made in Italy, which means they seem to be of a lesser standard than English/Danish stoves and are often not designed to be airtight, relying on chimney draught not to leak.
Smoke or CO alarms are unheard of over there.
Chimney fires are common, but chimneys are often twin walled concrete, or hollow brick which tends to resist heat better than our soft reds etc. Nearly everyone burns wood, yet I have never known anyone there to kill themselves.
So if you have followed ADJ to the best of your belief and amateur understanding, you'll probably be on this forum again in the spring to let us know you're still alive
I know this quote is a bit old, it just really winds me up when I see unfortunate situations like this, so I thought I'd let you all know the actual position (HETAS won't like this
That's the spin by HETAS! (and they'd like to keep it that way), they AREN'T a legal body, they are just a certifying body
You can have Building Control sign off a flue that a competent person (which could be you) has installed, or any one of these bodies can have 'competent' people certified for solid fuel:
"A person registered by Ascertiva Group Limited (NICEIC/Elecsa), Association of Plumbing and Heating Contractors (Certification) Limited, Benchmark Certification Limited, Building Engineering Services Competence Accreditation Limited, ECA Certification Limited, HETAS Limited or NAPIT Registration Limited in respect of that type of work."
How do I know? - we're with NAPIT
Here's the extract from the Building Regs:
Good post , I looked into this and sure enough anyone can install a stove , BUT to be legal it needs to be signed off by either HETAS or your local building control , I spoken to Plymouth council building control and they informed me the fee would be £252 if notified in advance or £370 retrospectively , I asked who inspected the installation and yes you guessed it ...they subcontract the job to a local HETAS engineer
Outrageous I know but local building control have to inspect it and the price is fixed so on a big job money could be save by DIYing , I did not ask the second visit fee if you balls it up
I have had a similar experience. First registered guy installed my porous stone hearth before removal of the sooty gas fire liner (which he left open and had pulled register plate out leaving my room open to the elements). He also eft me a flood and opened the chimney breast up without putting covers down - my whole room incl my computer, suede settee hundreds of books, tv etc all covered an soot. I have had tp pay to get my computer cleaned and my room. He had told me he was doing that part of the job later that week. Found another company - bought the stove and liner and then the fitter said he would charge me £1350 - to £1750 depending on work level - he didn't bother to come to view as arranged. I am now the owner of a stove and liner with jno-one interested in fitting it as they have already had my eyes out!
I'm appalled at the standard of these people, they are unscrupulous and flippant. I would never recommend having a stove fitted now to anyone.
I'm appalled at the standard of these people, they are unscrupulous and flippant. I would never recommend having a stove fitted now to anyone.
- Joined
- 7 Jan 2007
- Messages
- 8,836
- Reaction score
- 1,230
- Country
I know this quote is a bit old, it just really winds me up when I see unfortunate situations like this, so I thought I'd let you all know the actual position (HETAS won't like this
That's the spin by HETAS! (and they'd like to keep it that way), they AREN'T a legal body, they are just a certifying body
You can have Building Control sign off a flue that a competent person (which could be you) has installed, or any one of these bodies can have 'competent' people certified for solid fuel:
"A person registered by Ascertiva Group Limited (NICEIC/Elecsa), Association of Plumbing and Heating Contractors (Certification) Limited, Benchmark Certification Limited, Building Engineering Services Competence Accreditation Limited, ECA Certification Limited, HETAS Limited or NAPIT Registration Limited in respect of that type of work."
How do I know? - we're with NAPIT
Here's the extract from the Building Regs:
Good post , I looked into this and sure enough anyone can install a stove , BUT to be legal it needs to be signed off by either HETAS or your local building control , I spoken to Plymouth council building control and they informed me the fee would be £252 if notified in advance or £370 retrospectively , I asked who inspected the installation and yes you guessed it ...they subcontract the job to a local HETAS engineer
Outrageous I know but local building control have to inspect it and the price is fixed so on a big job money could be save by DIYing , I did not ask the second visit fee if you balls it up
Try talking to a lot of BC departments they hahaventot a clue !
Before Today I've had to inform them that dangerous unvented cylinder installations are their reresponibilityo police.
A big job obobvioulsyarries more risk of going wrong especially down the DIY route, how many diyers will find the point to open up a chimney to remove the broken down feathers and rebuild everything ?
I never sign off someone elses work on a new install, why wowouldake the risk on of a person diying a job, There's things you cannot see and check after the jobs been completed, why on earth would I take the risk.
Far too many deaths from co from solid fuel, There's a general view that solid fuel is easy and anyone can do it, like a lot of things it may look simple and easy but when its looked at in depth theres a lot more to it.
Idiots not using dust sheets shows theres numpties in all walks of life beit doctors, nurses, electricians, gas fitters, dentists, plumbers, builders politicians and hetas installers ( you should have had it all cleaned and sued him for the bill !!!!) and contacted Hetas.